Program #L7—“The Theological Adventures of Johnny Lukewarm and Pastor Loophole: Faith vs. Works”
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Radio Show Transcript, © 2001, Persuade The
World Ministries, Gordon James Klingenschmitt, Servant. Copying
and distribution (without editing) is highly encouraged.
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<Many more transcripts and free MP3 radio shows CLICK HERE>
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Opening introduction by Mark
McWilliams…
Welcome and thank you for joining this radio
broadcast of Persuade The World Ministries. You’re
about to hear our radio production of the book written and taught
by Gordon James Klingenschmitt, entitled “License To Sin,
The Number One Reason America Is Losing Its Moral
Foundation.” If you call us in the next hour,
we’ll mail you a free cassette tape of today’s
broadcast, which you can copy and give to your friends. Just
call our toll-free phone number: 866-Obey-God. That’s
toll free, 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D. Gordon James
Klingenschmitt is a graduate of the United States Air Force
Academy, and a seminary graduate of
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Thanks Mark. Today we continue our mini-drama entitled “The Theological Adventures of Johnny Lukewarm and Pastor Loophole.” You may remember our characters, Johnny Lukewarm, and Pastor Loophole from our last broadcast. But before we re-introduce these two characters, let’s read again from 2nd Timothy chapter 3. “For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths.” People often turn to counselors who tell them what their itching ears want to hear. As is the case with our character, Johnny Lukewarm, who comes into Pastor Loophole’s office to get advice…
(Lower) “Please have a seat, Johnny. What seems to be
bothering you today?”
Johnny’s brow furrows with concern. (Higher)
“Pastor Loophole, I’m very upset about this particular
passage of scripture. It seems as though God is commanding
me to do something I really don’t want to do. Do I
really have to repent, and stop sinning, and obey God? Or
is there some other alternative?
(Lower) “Why, certainly there is, Johnny, you just relax.
I can offer you dozens of alternatives, and give you very logical
reasons why you don’t have to obey God.”
(Higher) “Oh, thank goodness. For a minute there, I
thought I’d actually have to change my behavior and obey
God!” Johnny breathes a sigh of relief. He sits
forward eagerly, with his itching ears searching for some way of
escape from the Holy Spirit’s conviction. But the
Spirit of God is grieved away, and He slowly withdraws his
conviction from Johnny’s life.
(Start) Now
let’s continue on Loophole #4, as Pastor Loophole re-defines
the words salvation, grace, faith and works:
(Lower) “Johnny, it says here in Ephesians chapter two,
‘For it is by grace you have been saved,
through faith—and this not from
yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works,
so that no one can boast.’ [1] Now you’ve got
to understand the proper meaning of these words, Johnny. So
listen carefully to my definitions. Salvation, Grace,
Faith, and Works. If you just re-define these four words,
you’ll never have to give up your favorite sins.”
(Lower) Now
let’s re-define the word faith. Faith just means
mental assent, or believing or trusting in certain statements of
fact. This is the only requirement of salvation: just
believe that Jesus Christ died on the cross to forgive your sins.
If you personally and sincerely trust in this fact alone, Johnny,
something magical happens. It becomes real. You’re
forgiven of your sins, even while you continue to enjoy those
sins! You don’t have to submit to the Lordship of
Jesus Christ, or to let Him rule your heart—just believe
you’re forgiven and that makes it true. If you just
believe one single fact, that Jesus forgives your sins, then you
don’t have to repent or forsake those sins. Nothing
else is required. We’re saved by faith alone, Johnny.
Faith alone.”
TIME OUT !! Let’s look at the
scriptures everybody, and analyze Pastor Loophole’s advice.
Let’s rightly divide the word of truth, and separate the
truth from the lies in the advice given by Pastor Loophole.
First, I want to acknowledge the true part. It’s true
that “It is by grace you have been saved,
through faith—and this not from
yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works,
so that no one can boast.” [2] Nobody can argue
against that scripture. That’s the Biblical description of
how God saves us.
But the lie is that faith means mental assent to certain facts.
But here’s the truth: Genuine faith doesn’t just mean
you believe you’re forgiven, genuine faith means
whole-hearted submission to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. That’s
saving faith.
Most Christians know that we’re saved by
grace…through faith.[3] And most Christians also remember John
3:16— “whoever believes in Him shall not perish but
have eternal life.” And the Bible says Believe
in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved--you and your household.
But what exactly
does that mean, to believe in the Lord Jesus? Does it mean
you believe God exists, or that Jesus was a real person and a
good moral teacher and even the Son of God? Well just
believing in Jesus like that isn’t enough to get you saved,
because even the demons believe that—and shudder.[4]
Even the devil believes Jesus is the Son of God, but that
doesn’t mean the devil is saved and going to heaven.
So what does it
mean to believe in Jesus? Does it mean you believe He died
on the cross to pay the penalty for your personal sins? Or
that He rose from the dead? What if you even verbally
confess him as Lord with your own lips? Is that enough to
get you saved? Jesus says in Matthew 7, ‘Many will
say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord’.....Then I will
tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me,
you evildoers!’ [5] Think about that for a minute. Many
people will even call Jesus their Lord, and believe He died on
the cross to forgive their sins, but even they will be cast into
hell. So we’ve really got to ask the question again,
what does it mean to believe in the Lord Jesus?
Well, let’s look at somebody who had more faith in Christ
than anybody in all of Israel. Do you remember the Roman
Centurion in Matthew chapter 8? Jesus said nobody in Israel
had as much faith as that one Roman Centurion. Jesus said
his faith was genuine. So what did his faith look like?
Do you remember? The centurion said, “Lord, I do not
deserve to have you come under my roof. But just say the word,
and my servant will be healed. For I myself am a man under
authority, with soldiers under me. I tell this one,
‘Go,’ and he goes; and that one, ‘Come,’ and
he comes. I say to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does
it.” When Jesus heard this, he was astonished and said
to those following him, “I tell you the truth, I
have not found anyone in Israel with such great faith…[6]
Now Jesus defined genuine faith here. Did you get it?
Look closer. Faith means recognizing the authority of the
speaker, and submitting to Him. The centurion submitted
himself to Christ’s authority. In effect, he said,
“Jesus, you have authority over all things. You rank
so highly, that everybody must obey you, so I also submit to your
authority.” This centurion had genuine faith, the
greatest faith in all Israel. That’s the difference
between those who are saved and those who are going to hell.
Saved people submit to the authority of Jesus Christ. But
unsaved people refuse to do that. Even the devil believes
in God, but he won’t submit to God’s authority. The
devil has faith, but not saving faith, because he won’t let
God rule his heart. So you listening on the radio, let me
ask you a question. Do you believe in God, while you refuse
to let God rule your heart? If God doesn’t rule your
heart, you don’t have saving faith. You’re not
saved. And when God throws the devil into hell, God will
also throw you into hell. But it’s not too late.
Invite God to come and rule your heart, right now. Submit
yourself to Christ’s authority, like the Roman Centurion
did. He had the greatest faith in all of Israel, because he
let Jesus rule his heart.
Now to everybody out there listening, let me give two good
reasons why you oughtta submit your heart to Christ’s
authority. 1.) He Loves You. and 2.) He’s
smarter than you. Think about that for a second. Why
does Jesus want you to submit yourself to his authority? Because
He loves you and because he’s smarter than you.
When a mom and dad send their preschoolers outside, they say
“Don’t play in the street!” But why are mom
and dad so demanding? Are they mean-spirited, selfish,
controlling people? No! They’re just concerned
for their kids safety. 1.) They love ‘em. and
2.) They’re smarter than the preschoolers are. They
know it might be dangerous to play in the street. Now in
the same way, when God says— “Don’t be sexually
immoral. Don’t worship false Gods. Keep holy the
Sabbath day.”—why’s God so demanding? Well,
he’s looking out for your safety. Submit yourself to
God. God loves you and he’s smarter than you are.
Now the Apostle James wrote about two kinds of faith: Living
Faith, and Dead Faith. So Johnny Lukewarm, if you’re
listening out there, I agree you have faith, but is your faith
alive or is it dead?
Let’s read from James 2: What good is it, my
brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can
such faith save him?…faith by itself, if it is not
accompanied by action, is dead…You believe that there is one
God. Good! Even the demons believe that— and
shudder…faith without works is dead…Was not Abraham our
father justified by works…faith wrought with his works, and
by works was faith made perfect…a person is justified by
what he does and not by faith alone…As the body without the
spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.[7]
So let me ask you,
is your faith dead, or is it alive? You know if your faith
is dead, it can never save you from hell?
Now from these
scriptures, let’s properly define the word Believe: To
believe in the Lord Jesus means “to submit your heart to the
rulership of the Lord Jesus” or “To bow your knee to
the authority of the Lord Jesus” or “To worship the
Lord Jesus with all your heart and mind and soul” That’s
what it means to believe in the Lord Jesus.
Submission to
Christ’s authority is the only difference between those who
truly “believe in Christ” and are saved and going to
heaven, and those who claim to “believe in Christ” but
are not saved and are not going to heaven.
You know, if you
refuse to submit your heart to Christ’s rulership,
you’re an unbeliever. You don’t believe in the
Lord Jesus, because you don’t want Him to rule your heart.
If this is you, don’t call yourself a Christian. Faith
means submission to Christ’s authority. But if
you’ve never invited Jesus to come and rule your heart,
you’re still an unbeliever. If Christ is not your
Lord, then he’s not your Savior either. If Christ is
not your Lord, you have no saving faith.
Let’s pray together. Would you to just stop what you’re doing for a moment, and pray with me to God? Just pray these words to God with me. “Father in heaven, I confess that my faith has been hollow, and shallow, and worthless, because I haven’t submitted my heart to your authority. I haven’t really believed in you, because I haven’t invited you to come and rule my heart. But I want to change that now. I repent, Lord, and I submit my heart to your authority. Come and rule my heart now, Lord Jesus, and take over every part of my life. I’m not my own boss anymore. Lord Jesus, you are my boss from now on. I submit to your rulership right now. I receive your forgiveness of my sins, and I thank you in Jesus name, Amen.” Did you just pray with me? If you prayed with me, say Amen. Go ahead and say it out loud. Amen. Now if you just said Amen, I want you to write to me and get a copy of this book you’re hearing me teach from. Here’s Mark with that information.
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Middle segment by Mark McWilliams…
Thanks Gordon. He’ll be back in just a moment. But first, do you know somebody who needs to hear today’s message? If you call our toll-free number in the next hour, 866-Obey-God, we’ll mail you a free cassette tape of today’s broadcast, which you can copy and give to your friends. All our tapes are copyable and free, but please remember we need your donations to stay on the air and to give away these free tapes. So please pray and obey, then send us your best possible donation, after you receive your free cassette. (Gordon: Hey time out! If it’s your first time calling us, no donation is required! Just call us!) Our toll free number is 866-Obey-God, that’s 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D. And please specify you’re requesting today’s program. Do you believe America needs to hear these messages? If so, then we need you to sponsor us, by joining the Persuader’s Club with a monthly pledge of just $15. If you join the Persuader’s Club, we’ll also send you an autographed copy of Gordon’s book that you’ve been hearing. Just visit our web-site at persuaders-club.com. Or call us in the next hour at 866-Obey-God. Right now, let’s return to Gordon James Klingenschmitt.
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Thanks, Mark.
Now let’s continue with Loophole #4, as Pastor Loophole
re-defines the words salvation, grace, faith and works:
(Lower) Johnny,
let’s re-define the word works. This is very
important. We’re not saved by good works, Johnny.
In fact, things like repentance and holiness and love and
submission to God’s authority, those are just good works,
Johnny. And good works are optional when it comes to
salvation. So you don’t have to repent, or be holy,
and you can still go to heaven! You don’t have to love
God or submit to God’s authority, and God still forgives
you, even while you continue to enjoy your sins. After all,
we’re not saved by good works, Johnny, we’re saved by
faith alone. Just believe you’re forgiven, faith
alone.”
TIME OUT !! Let’s go back to the
scriptures everybody, and analyze Pastor Loophole’s advice.
Let’s rightly divide the word of truth, and separate the
truth from the lies in the advice given by Pastor Loophole.
Again, I want to acknowledge the true part. It’s true
that “It is by grace you have been saved,
through faith—and this not from
yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works,
so that no one can boast.” [8] I love that
scripture. That’s the Biblical description of how God
saves us.
But the lie is that holiness is the same as good works, or loving
God is the same as good works, or submitting your heart to the
authority of Christ is the same as good works. That’s
a lie! But here’s the truth to replace that lies:
Holiness and submission and love come from your heart, not from
your hands. Holiness and submission and love are not the
same as good works, they’re elements of genuine faith.
If your heart is full of sincere faith, it’ll also be full
of holiness and full of love toward God and you’ll love
submitting to God’s rulership. These things are not
good works, they’re elements of genuine faith in Christ!!
Let me repeat that we’re not saved through our good works.
The Bible warns us that Israel, who pursued a law of
righteousness, has not attained it. Why
not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by
works.[9] And again, the
Bible says there is a remnant chosen by grace. And if by
grace, then it is no longer by works; if it
were, grace would no longer be grace.[10] The Bible teaches we’re saved by
grace through faith, not by our good works.
We are saved when God influences our hearts toward voluntary
submission to His rulership. God’s gracious influence
saves us and separates us from our deadly sins. Now the
good works that you do with your hands result from that, but if
your heart isn’t changed and you don’t love God,
pursuing good works is meaningless. May no theological
critic ever accuse me of preaching salvation by works.
No, I preach salvation by faith. Submitting your heart to
God’s rulership is the same as genuine faith. Repentance
and holiness of heart are the same as genuine faith. Loving
God with all your heart is the same as genuine faith. If
you don’t repent and if your heart isn’t holy and you
don’t submit to God’s rulership over your heart and you
don’t love God with your heart, mind, soul and strength, you
don’t have genuine faith. This isn’t preaching
salvation by works, it’s preaching salvation by faith!
The Bible says, Everything
that does not come from faith is sin[11]
(which is the opposite of holiness). So holiness and
faith go hand in hand, and they both start with wholehearted
repentance. So cleanse your heart. Believe. Submit.
Be holy. Be clean.
The Bible says, without
faith, it is impossible to please God.[12] It also says, without
holiness, no one will see the Lord.[13] Now how can anyone claim to have saving
faith and go to heaven, without holiness? Fight the good
fight, holding on to faith and a good conscience. Some have
rejected these and so have shipwrecked their faith.[14]
Johnny, is your conscience clear, or are you shipwrecking
your faith? Again, what’s the foundation of
Christianity? Is it faith, or repentance, or both? Therefore
let us leave the elementary teachings…not laying again the
foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of
faith in God…[15]
Holiness, sinlessness, repentance, submission to authority, and
faith. These words all mean the same thing. Unholiness,
unrepentance, sin, rebellion to authority, and unbelief. These
words also mean basically the same thing. Johnny, without
holiness, you have no saving faith. Faith without holiness
is not really faith at all.
Did you know saving
faith is also the same thing as loving God with all your heart?
Jesus gave us two commandments: Love God and Love Your Neighbor.[16] Holiness and faith require our
heartfelt obedience to these two commands. If faith without
works is dead, then faith without love is even
less—it’s nothing. The Bible says if I
have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am
nothing.[17]
Did you know love helps atone for our sins? It says in
Proverbs, through love and faithfulness sin is atoned
for…[18]
Faith can’t express itself without love. The Bible
says The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself
through love.[19]
Again, for you
ladies, what are the requirements of salvation? The Bible
says in 1 Tim 2, women will be saved…if they continue in
faith, love and holiness.[20]
So am I saying love a requirement for salvation? No, The
Bible is. We know that we have passed from death to
life, because we love our brothers. Anyone who does not love
remains in death.[21]
Again, how do you know if you’re really saved and really
been born of God? The Bible says, Everyone who loves has
been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does
not know God.[22]
So if you think you’re saved by faith, but you don’t
love God and neighbor, your faith isn’t real, and it
can’t save you from hell. Love isn’t optional,
like good works. Love is an element of genuine faith.
Saving Faith requires that you love God and neighbor.
While we’re
not saved by good works; your heart change can’t be genuine
if good works don’t result. The first requirement for
eternal salvation is that you change your heart and repent.
When your heart’s genuinely changed, good works will
naturally follow. If you’ve really repented, it’s
easy to tell because your behavior changes too. But if your
heart never really changed, you can tell right away because your
deeds remain evil too. This is how we know
who the children of God are and who the children of the devil
are: Anyone who does not do what is right is not a child of God;
nor is anyone who does not love his brother.[23] This is how we know you’re
not saved, Johnny Lukewarm, if you’re out there listening.
Because we can see your lack of good works. But God knows
even sooner, because he sees your unchanged heart. Man
looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at [your]
heart.[24]
Your lack of good
works proves that your heart never really changed. Your
continual sin, seldom if ever broken by repentance, is
conclusive, legally binding evidence that you’ve never been
born again. The Bible says, No one who is born of God
will continue to sin…he cannot go on sinning, because he has
been born of God. [25]
Your evil works and sinful deeds prove you
are not a child of God.
Let’s stop and pray about this. If you can hear my
voice, stop what you’re doing and let’s get this right
before God. Pray these words along with me to God. Go
ahead and repeat after me. “Father in heaven, I
confess that my heart has never really changed. It’s
obvious by my lack of good works, Lord, but the real problem is
that I need to get my heart right with you. Lord, I confess
that I have not lived a holy life, and I haven’t loved you
with all my heart. I am so sorry for that, Lord. I
repent, right now. I change the desires of my heart to make
you my number one priority. I choose to love you Lord, even
more than I love my own self. God, come and rule my heart,
I pray in Jesus powerful name. Amen.”
Did you pray with me just now? If you prayed with me, would
you say Amen? Go ahead, say it out loud. Amen, Lord
Jesus. Some of you are receiving a physical healing in your
body right now, as God’s loving rulership takes over in your
heart. I hope you’ll write to us and tell us about
that. But if you said Amen just now, whoever you are, I
want you to write to us and get a copy of this book you’re
hearing me teach from. I’ve been very fortunate and
blessed to have this book read and endorsed by people like C.
Peter Wagner, Tony Campolo, Jon Mark Ruthven who was my
systematic theology professor, Pastors Ted Haggard and Floyd
McClung, Joy Dawson and Bill Hamon. So you know it’s
trustworthy. In our book and in future broadcasts,
we’ll answer the questions you may have about eternal
security or eternal salvation. And you’ll hear more
theological adventures of Johnny Lukewarm and Pastor Loophole.
So I hope you’ll write us tune in again next time. Now
I love you, and I care about you. So here’s Mark with
more information.
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Closing trailer by Mark McWilliams…
Thanks Gordon, and thanks everybody for
listening. Do you know somebody who needs to hear today’s
message? If you call our toll-free number in the next hour,
866-Obey-God, we’ll mail you a free cassette tape of
today’s broadcast, which you can copy and give to your
friends. All our tapes are copyable and free, but please remember
that we need your donations to stay on the air and to give away
these free tapes. So please pray and obey God about how
much these teachings are worth to you, and return to us your best
possible gift after you receive your free cassette. (Gordon:
Hey time out! If it’s your first time contacting us,
no donation is required! Just call us!) Our toll free
number is 866-Obey-God, that’s 1-866-O-B-E-Y-G-O-D,
and please specify you’re requesting today’s program.
Now do you believe
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<Many more transcripts and free MP3 radio shows CLICK HERE>
[1] Ephesians 2:8-9 (NIV)
[2] Ephesians 2:8-9 (NIV)
[3] Ephesians 2:8-9 (NIV)
[4] James 2:19 (NIV)
[5] Matthew 7:22-23 (NIV)
[6] Matt 8:5-13 (NIV)
[7] (NIV and KJV)
[8] Ephesians 2:8-9 (NIV)
[9] Romans 9:31-32 (NIV)
[10] Romans 11:5-6 (NIV)
[11] Romans 14:23 (NIV)
[12] Hebrews 11:6 (NIV)
[13] Hebrews 12:14 (NIV)
[14] 1 Tim 1:18-19 (NIV)
[15] Heb 6:1 (NIV)
[16] See Luke 10:25-28
[17] 1 Cor 13:2 (NIV)
[18] Prov 16:6 (NIV)
[19] Galatians 5:6 (NIV)
[20] 1 Tim 2:15 (NIV)
[21] 1 John 3:14 (NIV)
[22] 1 John 4:7-8 (NIV)
[23] 1 John 3:10 (NIV)
[24] 1 Sam 16:7 (NIV)
[25] 1 John 3:9 (NIV)